6 hours ... finally have ONE fender on.  What a freaking nightmare. Supposed to be a 2 hour job per side. More like 4, if you dont run into all the problems i did. ( and i expect some on the other side. its going to wait until next weekend )

AND come to find out, the blinkers i bought.  only work during the day.. arrrgh.

Got a sunburn too. ON MY HEAD...   never had that happen before.

So... I've come to the conclusion that having "our" M4 isn't working for me. I'm sticking with MY 97 Z3 for now. 

And considering buying *my* newer Beemer that is still pretty damn old and well-worn - if I can find one that checks all the boxes. 

The frustrating thing - and I don't know if this belongs in hot rodding or sex and relationships... but... 


When I was an heir to an estate with a house worth about $500k paid free and clear, making six figures as an IT guy, putting my wife through her Masters while she was making $50k a year... I made sure she had the Discovery she wanted, even though I thought they were pieces of shit mechanically. I had a much newer 328i, and a much older 325ic - but she also had the car she wanted - that she could have never afforded otherwise. 

But on the other side of the dot.com implosion, I'm the one bringing in $50k and she is bringing in twice what I made at my highest, maybe 3 times. 

And... I think she feels like she bought me the Denali 2500 - which is a nice truck - but I'm not the Big Truck guy. She is the big truck girl. 


Evidently, she is also more the expensive European track car girl, too... and I just get to drive the cars SHE wants. 


So... Yeah... I think I'm a 135iC guy, soon. I want a manual transmission, a soft top, and enough bhp at the rear wheels to ensure that a Camary SE 6 isn't going to dust me. 

But at this point, I don't even want to drive the M4... because it just isn't enjoyable. 

 I should have taken my shares from Intel and bought something then - but I put it into the family and bought new AC units. Our financial future wasn't as clear at that time though - so I did the responsible thing. 

I feel like I've been doing that since I was 24... and the pay off has been that I get to drive a rich woman's M4, occasionally. 

Which - I guess isn't the *worst* deal, if you're able to swallow your pride. I don't think I can do that. 

Literally... this... 

I had a 67. 

Yeah, a 135 Cabrio is surprisingly affordable with very low mileage. I'm torn between it and a M240 or even M235 cab. Either one will put a particularly painful impact on my income - but, I can't spend everything I make and what is left over all goes to pay "Family" bills anyhow... so maybe I should spend as much of it as I can per month on myself, anyhow. Although from that logic, I could probably swing a pretty new M4. Should get one exactly the same and park it next to the one in the garage now. 

I loved my e36 328i and my e30 325i both. They're very fun cars. The problem is... in the last 15-20 years BMW went from undisputed driver's choice to one choice of many. Americans finally figured out handling - and the Koreans are kicking ass too. 

Chevy Chase was once in a movie called "Funny Farm." It is a movie about the wife having success as an author while the husband fails as one. There is a scene that stuck out to me back then... their stuff has all gotten lost during move-in and they have nothing to eat. They're going to bed, Chevy has his head on his wife's lap, and she is stroking his head and as he drifts off to sleep on the hardwood floor, his eyes suddenly bolt open to the sound off-screen of an apple being bitten into. 

Tue Jun 01 2021 13:30:08 EDT from LoanShark

I just upgraded from a 2014 328i to a 2017 330i (with the N26 and B46 engines, respectively) and I'm quite satisfied with the powertrain. If you want a little more bhp, I don't think you can go wrong with the 135i (I assume you're talking about the older 1-series that still was based on a RWD/longitudinally-mounted platform)

Picked up a M235 last night. 50k miles. Take delivery tomorrow. Traded my 1997 Z3 2.8 with 100200 miles on it in... got $4k... which is a pretty decent trade in, I think. 

Also got quite a bit off the asking price. I did throw in a warranty. We'll see how smart that was. 

Manageable payments. An M240 would have put me at a much higher payment, and an 135 would have been more affordable - so this was a nice middle ground. Aftermarket cold air intake and exhaust that claim to be good for about 18 more hp. 

Got an auto - because... the manuals are frickin' hard to find. 

Feels a little more unsettled in the rear end than the M4 - similar to the Z3. Shorter wheelbase? I got it up to triple digits - but not a prolonged period at ~130 mph... I'm not sure I'd care for that kind of speed in this, compared to doing those kinds of speeds in the M4 - where it still feels very firmly planted and civil. Anyhow, the last thing I'm looking for is a felony speed stop while doing a *test drive*. 

Anyhow... I'm done with the M4. My wife can be one of those women who buy a top of the line M because it is the "best" BMW then lose their mind when those big, grippy, soft tires wear out on trips to the dry cleaners and nail salon. 

I'm going to have a much more affordable baby M that won't have as steep of maintenance costs, doesn't have a 500 pound hard top sitting over the rear axle, and goes nearly as fast for around 1/4th the cost. 

I think she is going to be upset when she realizes I don't hand-wash cars with ceramic coats that aren't *my* M, though - but I'll be glad to let her use my bucket and sponge to wash her car herself. We can even make a couple's date out of hand-washing our M's together. ;) 

Tue Jun 01 2021 17:16:53 EDT from LoanShark

I've driven a friend's 230i (M Sport edition with Track Handling Package and manual transmission.) We took it out for some sweeping corners on a mountain road upstate -- taking some less-than-70mph corners at 70mph, enough to induce a bit of body roll.

No complaints. The suspension all seemed tight.

If the body was rolling a bit, you know he was pushing it way harder than, say, a Miata... it did not seem to exhibit any of the F30's lack of damping.

I will hose the mud off the jeep myself.   Does that count? 

:)

Wed Jun 02 2021 05:06:17 PM EDT from ParanoidDelusions

I think she is going to be upset when she realizes I don't hand-wash cars with ceramic coats that aren't *my* M, though - but I'll be glad to let her use my bucket and sponge to wash her car herself. We can even make a couple's date out of hand-washing our M's together. ;) 

 

I mentioned it casually tonight, and she took it in good spirits. 

I guess maybe she realizes just how *not great* this turned out for me that I was so quickly determined to just go fucking buy my own. Usually she isn't really good at getting messages like this. She mentioned tonight that I still have to drive the M4, because even though she *loves* the car - she'll never drive it like it is meant to be driven. I don't *exactly* see the point. 

From the start this was one of my concerns. I knew my 328i and 325iC because I drove them daily - so I learned their limits, the point where they broke loose, how to induce just enough oversteer, when to brake. Switching back and forth between a GMC 2500, an M4, and a Z3 constantly was making me drive all 3 of them badly. Too fast in the GMC, too slow in the M4, forgetting to shift in the Z... braking too easy in the GMC, too hard in the M4. It wasn't *just* about the petty things... my pride or being upset that it was a shared vehicle that everyone was calling "her" car. It was also that having to respect it as a shared vehicle meant I couldn't make it really mine. 

This one, I'll be able to own - not in the sense of "I'm paying for it," but in, "I understand its nuances". 

Wed Jun 02 2021 19:32:04 EDT from Nurb432

I will hose the mud off the jeep myself.   Does that count? 

:)

 

Wed Jun 02 2021 05:06:17 PM EDT from ParanoidDelusions

I think she is going to be upset when she realizes I don't hand-wash cars with ceramic coats that aren't *my* M, though - but I'll be glad to let her use my bucket and sponge to wash her car herself. We can even make a couple's date out of hand-washing our M's together. ;) 

 

Yeah, had a blast with it tonight. Really just cruising around - but even doing that, it is a blast to drive. 

The F30 era 3 series did have a notoriously skittish rear end - I can't really do this without sounding like I'm bragging - but it was also a very well balanced car, and if you knew it well, you could do *amazing* things with it. My first "eurostyle" coupe was a Datsun 510 with an L18 engine, weber carb, and 240z 5 speed tranny. It was an incredible car - and I could basically do skate-tricks in it, consistently. I could always put it right where I wanted it... I mean, I'd go into a turn, whip it around 180, spin it, and end up facing the way I originally wanted to turn... On rainy days taking left turns I'd always slide the rear end out and drift it through the corner - in two-turn-lane traffic... when I was 17 or 18... I just really knew the balance of that car - and I never ended up in a wreck with any other vehicle or object. The E30 became like that for me. 

Once I was driving it to work, and there was a guy in front of me. He indicated and turned right into a drive way, and I kept going, when suddenly he whipped it back around and out into the lane. I swerved hard, 90 degrees - to the left to avoid him, but someone else was coming OUT of a drive way that way, head on at me. I whipped it back to the right hard, and these two cars, they were parallel to one another - like an offset = sign.... 

  _ --

And I literally threaded myself through the little gap between them as they were both rolling, like, I spun an S through their gap, which WASN'T actually big enough to fit through any other way, I mean... First I was driving straight, then I'm drifting it hard to the left, then swinging it around to drift to the right, then I'm past them, but headed at the curb on the right, so I had to whip it back straight... and I just kept going. With the top down. :) 

That is to say - I didn't find the suspension of the E30 problematic. It wasn't as stable or confident as the E36, for sure... but it was still a car with *excellent* handling. I had a '97 Mustang 4.6l GT for a while. That was a car that was waiting for ANY mistake to betray you. The live rear axle was terrible - and I used to see them spun out on the highway all the time. 

The Z3 has an E30 rear end, too, despite technically being an e36 era car. 

The M235... small and nimble is exactly it... I just feel more natural in a corner - it communicates the wheels better to me as a driver (than the M4). It has a great horsepower to weight ratio to make it move VERY quick... but it doesn't feel as overwhelming - there isn't so much mass fighting you. Cars like the M4, the Camaro, the Cobra... "GT" class cars, I guess... they're usually kind of beasts. This is a little tamer. 

I don't know where the limits of the M4 are - because wherever they are, they're way beyond my confidence in my ability to find, most likely. 

I think this will be far better suited to my skills as a driver. Especially as I'm getting older and my reflexes and reaction times are not what they used to be. Don't get me wrong... the M4 is an AMAZING car - and there isn't much on the highway that can challenge it including most "common" American V8 muscle. You've got to get up to something like a Hellcat or a ZL1, or a C7/C8 Vette - or exotic or M5 - or something highly tuned to the point of questionable street-legality before the M4 is going to lose... But all of those cars depend on a VERY competent driver behind the wheel to keep all that power pointed in the right direction in hard driving. I think the M235/240 is probably more forgiving of a less talented driver behind the wheel - and I'm perfectly OK with that. :) 

Thu Jun 03 2021 17:24:02 EDT from LoanShark

2-series suspension has a much better reputation than the F30-era 3-series.

I guess maybe it's not an M4, but the 2 should be a pretty darn good driver's car nonetheless. Small and nimble too.

You know, I stopped after the E series for quite a while. A combination of finances and lack of enthusiasm for where BMW was headed during that era - first the super high compression M3 straight 6s that blew their heads - in an attempt to keep up with Audi twin turbos, then going with the 4l V8 - (which is evidently a beloved version of the M3)... I bought the Z3, hated the lines of the Z4 (though they got better with the hard top versions...) and that SAAB style flat expanse of dash on the Z4... the crease on the side... They started coming out with all of these model lines. X5, X3, 8, 6, A B C D E F G... 

My wife had an X5 - but I never really cared for it. I had an Escalade, after that a GMC 1500, then a GMC 2500 - and the Z3 through all of those. 

So... I guess my mind just filled in the F30 with E30... 

The E36, I once ended up in a neck-and-neck race with a SAAB 95, headed from Sacramento up to Folsom on the way to Intel. There is a famous curve on Highway 50 called "The Sunrise Curve" right before Folsom, and we were both barreling into it at about 135 MPH - the highway was devoid of traffic. As we came up on the Sunrise underpass, which marks the start of the curve, I stared intently ahead with the peddle mashed, and out of my peripheral vision, I saw the SAAB driver look over at me, once, twice, then suddenly his car dropped back. I entered the curve flat out (I was on Z rated plus sized tires that were grippy as hell, the only non-stock upgrade on the car)... I did not brake but let off the gas as I steered into the curve... and I heard this... *noise*... 

wwhhhrrrr whhhrr whhhhr badump badump... whrrr whrrr whrrr badump badump... 

I was trying to figure out what it was... when I realized the K-wall/Center divide was growing ever close to me. I was making the curve, but I was in 4 wheel drift to the outside of the lanes... right as my left wheels went over the lane guides into the inside breakdown lane, the wheels caught grip, I mashed the peddle, induced some oversteer, the back got its grip and I flew out of the curve and back into the fast lane.  

A few moments later, at a more reasonable 90 MPH, the SAAB caught up to me, and the guy was smiling and shaking his head up and down and giving me huge thumbs-ups! He was literally *beaming* at me. It was kinda comical. 

The adrenaline of what I had just done was hitting me, and I must have looked like I had Parkinson's disease when I lifted up my hand to wave back at him. :) 

But that was an E36. Their balance and confidence was so... secure. They weren't at all skittish - ever. I never felt like the back end was skipping or shimmying or twitching. It always followed the front end perfectly. I think if I had tried that in the E30, I'd be in a wheelchair right now, if I lived. 

Anyhow... the M235i F uh... 22? Felt more similar to the E30 than the E36 to me yesterday, though today it was growing on me. It almost feels like sometimes the rear end wants to track differently than the front end - especially in quick lane changes. 

BUT... the steering is incredible - The M4 gets beat up for having uncommunicative steering - and I didn't get that. But, compared to the M235... I get what people are talking about. I know *exactly* where the wheels are and what they're doing on the surface and where it is going to take me. I think a lot of this is a matter of mass though. The M4 is a heavier car with way wider wheels. It feels more like a car like a Mustang GT... the M235 reminds me more of my E30 - or even my Datsun 510... a much lighter, more nimble, more "tossable" car that really tells the driver what is going on with the road. 

I did destroy a Merc E350 today. Basically just played with him up to the point where it was clear he had given up. 

Fri Jun 04 2021 15:32:08 EDT from LoanShark

(Seems to be a little confusion about E30/F30 here - whatever, I guess *both* of them are known for their occasionally floaty suspension.)


Err, maybe that's not quite right. I've never driven an E30, but we were talking about this a few months ago. With E30, maybe the problem was the rear was too firm and nervous, whereas with the F30 the problem can be floatiness.

Just for the record.  i hate broken bolts.   

Broken bolts do suck. Valtteri Bottas hates stripped lug nuts too, right about now. 

https://www.carscoops.com/2021/05/the-stripped-wheel-nut-that-ended-valtteri-bottas-monaco-gp-is-still-stuck-on-the-car/

Fri Jun 04 2021 21:53:14 EDT from Nurb432

Just for the record.  i hate broken bolts.   

Every BMW I've had has needed gaskets replaced around 75k miles because they were leaking like sieves - and most of them were normally aspirated straight 6s. I replaced the head gasket on the Z3 a couple of years ago, and it was a competent guy who did it. It really cut back on the leaking, and the smell of burning oil (and sometimes smoke) in the cockpit. 

But I still managed to slip on the oil that missed the pan and ended up on my garage floor while setting up the opener for the M234 last night. :) 

I'll probably clean that up next weekend, and count on having to do it again about 25k miles from now. :) 

I remember the first generation after the e36 M3 (I think it was the e40?) they experimented with a super high compression i6 trying to compete with Audi's twin turbo V6 on the S4 and they were blowing heads all the time - then they switched to the V8 which was ALSO high compression and ALSO blew heads... and - then they came out with every variant of BMW they could think of and I lost interest for a while. 

I'm kinda back. I ended up racing a Mustang 5.0 GT from a rolling start last night in the 235. The first run, I pulled FAR ahead - WAY quicker. Not the kind of decisive spanking that the M4 gives to a car like that - but just a constant creep ahead of him. 

I gave him a second chance and let him get rolling a little first, and couldn't catch up to him as we hit the high end - My understanding is that at the high end when the turbos kick in that is where the 235i should walk away from the 5.0 - and the videos I've seen were consistent with that I was in sport, not sport+, and there was traffic in the lane ahead of me, I was with my wife, and the back end felt a little unsettled - so I let it go. I would have liked to have a long, open straight road ahead of us and seen what would have happened if we both kept the peddle mashed - because the first run... I had him confidently. 

I like them both for different reasons... the M4 makes a lot of fast cars look absolutely slow. The 235i on the other hand surprises a lot of fast cars when it is equal to or slightly faster than they are. The 235i feels GREAT tossing around curves and corners at more moderate speeds - but feels a little like the back is experiencing trailer sway at higher speeds - which I don't care for at all. That may come down to just the rubber, or alignment, or something else in the suspension. I saw someone else reporting the same experience. It is like if I change lanes to the right, when I straight out the front tires, the back wants to keep tracking to the right... and a quick adjustment brings it back too far to the left... just a bit, but enough that the quick "too far left, too far right," isn't confidence instilling at speeds of about 80 to 120. The steering on the M4 is more numb than the 235i - it would be *terrible* if the M4 were doing this and ALSO not letting me know *exactly* where the front wheels are and what they're doing. At least with the 235, I feel confident that I'm making the right corrections up front for whatever bullshit is going on in the back. 

Mon Jun 07 2021 14:49:05 EDT from LoanShark

headed during that era - first the super high compression M3 straight
6s that blew their heads - in an attempt to keep up with Audi twin

These turbos (present in both my B46 and your 6-cyl turbo in the 235i) have pretty high compression. Higher than what used to be possible in a turbo, and probably about the same as that old naturally aspirated 6 and V8 before they switched over to turbos on everything.

But they also have direct injection, which definitely helps control detonation. It'll be interesting to see how long they last. My N26 made it to 90K+ miles before the accident, and it had *not a single hint* of gasket leaks or anything like that. It never consumed a drop of oil between changes.

I was with the wife and at around 110 and still accelerating on a fairly bumpy highway she kind of tersely said, "Ok... that is enough. That is enough..." 

And so I let him go. ;) 

Mon Jun 07 2021 20:47:14 EDT from ParanoidDelusions

Every BMW I've had has needed gaskets replaced around 75k miles because they were leaking like sieves - and most of them were normally aspirated straight 6s. I replaced the head gasket on the Z3 a couple of years ago, and it was a competent guy who did it. It really cut back on the leaking, and the smell of burning oil (and sometimes smoke) in the cockpit. 

But I still managed to slip on the oil that missed the pan and ended up on my garage floor while setting up the opener for the M234 last night. :) 

I'll probably clean that up next weekend, and count on having to do it again about 25k miles from now. :) 

I remember the first generation after the e36 M3 (I think it was the e40?) they experimented with a super high compression i6 trying to compete with Audi's twin turbo V6 on the S4 and they were blowing heads all the time - then they switched to the V8 which was ALSO high compression and ALSO blew heads... and - then they came out with every variant of BMW they could think of and I lost interest for a while. 

I'm kinda back. I ended up racing a Mustang 5.0 GT from a rolling start last night in the 235. The first run, I pulled FAR ahead - WAY quicker. Not the kind of decisive spanking that the M4 gives to a car like that - but just a constant creep ahead of him. 

I gave him a second chance and let him get rolling a little first, and couldn't catch up to him as we hit the high end - My understanding is that at the high end when the turbos kick in that is where the 235i should walk away from the 5.0 - and the videos I've seen were consistent with that I was in sport, not sport+, and there was traffic in the lane ahead of me, I was with my wife, and the back end felt a little unsettled - so I let it go. I would have liked to have a long, open straight road ahead of us and seen what would have happened if we both kept the peddle mashed - because the first run... I had him confidently. 

I like them both for different reasons... the M4 makes a lot of fast cars look absolutely slow. The 235i on the other hand surprises a lot of fast cars when it is equal to or slightly faster than they are. The 235i feels GREAT tossing around curves and corners at more moderate speeds - but feels a little like the back is experiencing trailer sway at higher speeds - which I don't care for at all. That may come down to just the rubber, or alignment, or something else in the suspension. I saw someone else reporting the same experience. It is like if I change lanes to the right, when I straight out the front tires, the back wants to keep tracking to the right... and a quick adjustment brings it back too far to the left... just a bit, but enough that the quick "too far left, too far right," isn't confidence instilling at speeds of about 80 to 120. The steering on the M4 is more numb than the 235i - it would be *terrible* if the M4 were doing this and ALSO not letting me know *exactly* where the front wheels are and what they're doing. At least with the 235, I feel confident that I'm making the right corrections up front for whatever bullshit is going on in the back. 

Mon Jun 07 2021 14:49:05 EDT from LoanShark

headed during that era - first the super high compression M3 straight
6s that blew their heads - in an attempt to keep up with Audi twin

These turbos (present in both my B46 and your 6-cyl turbo in the 235i) have pretty high compression. Higher than what used to be possible in a turbo, and probably about the same as that old naturally aspirated 6 and V8 before they switched over to turbos on everything.

But they also have direct injection, which definitely helps control detonation. It'll be interesting to see how long they last. My N26 made it to 90K+ miles before the accident, and it had *not a single hint* of gasket leaks or anything like that. It never consumed a drop of oil between changes.