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[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 09:51:11 EDT from LoanShark

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2021-09-29 17:12 from IGnatius T Foobar

You know what ... after settling on a permanent Version 10, Apple
released Version 11 of their operating system. And then in a move that

surprised no one ... Microsoft, having settled on a permanent Version

10, is moving to Version 11 of their operating system.

It seems clear that what was originally intended as a regular Win10 feature release was (first) delayed a year or two and (second) renamed Win11.

(WSL2-gui was originally in a W10 preview build, but now will apparently require Win11... etc)

[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 09:59:28 EDT from Nurb432

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Its all a marketing scam.



[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 10:46:28 EDT from LoanShark

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2021-10-02 09:59 from Nurb432
Its all a marketing scam.


My dad (a car guy) would call it "planned obsolescence" and compare it to Detroit.

(They updated the hardware requirements.)

Of course, I just built him a new PC a month or two ago, and it was 3X faster in his Excel workload so I don't see him complaining that it made his old hardware obsolete...

[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 10:50:51 EDT from Nurb432

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Some of it sure, but there have been advancements in tech too so it wasn't always 'planned'. ( which they often use as a tool for forced upgrades.. )



[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 10:52:05 EDT from LoanShark

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He just likes to complain. We all know that hardware keep improving and that it doesn't make sense to support the old stuff indefinitely.

[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 11:05:55 EDT from Nurb432

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Hes not 100% wrong either however. ( having been in automotive myself close to 20 years, before i went pubic sector.. )

Sat Oct 02 2021 10:52:05 AM EDT from LoanShark

He just likes to complain. We all know that hardware keep improving and that it doesn't make sense to support the old stuff indefinitely.

 



[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 16:27:07 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar

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My dad (a car guy) would call it "planned obsolescence" and compare it

to Detroit.

Of course. We know how to build light bulbs that will last forever, but we don't build them (except in Dubai, apparently).

I personally don't care what versions Apple and Microsoft slap on their operating systems, because I run Linux, and my work machine runs whatever some drone in IT installs on it. What I do care about is that Bill Gates is not yet worm food, and that needs to change quickly.

My rig here at home is less than two years old. I just reinstalled it last week because there were a couple of things I wanted to change (UEFI booting, and btrfs on the root filesystem). From what I am hearing, it sounds like home-built rigs are going to become more popular, because Micro$oft wants to mandate Virtualization Based Security on mass-produced computers. Some people have reported up to a 25% performance degradation when VBS is running.

[#] Sat Oct 02 2021 16:53:02 EDT from Nurb432

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All part of the plan " just upgrade "....

Sat Oct 02 2021 04:27:07 PM EDT from IGnatius T Foobar
. Some people have reported up to a 25% performance degradation when VBS is running.

 



[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 00:34:02 EDT from ParanoidDelusions

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Went to the mall today, the Microsoft Store there has folded. Apple won that round. 

 

Wed Sep 29 2021 17:12:51 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar

You know what ... after settling on a permanent Version 10, Apple released Version 11 of their operating system. And then in a move that surprised no one ... Microsoft, having settled on a permanent Version 10, is moving to Version 11 of their operating system.

I have a message for Microsoft. Listen closely, Satya. Microsoft will NEVER be as good as Apple until you arrange for Microsoft's founder and original CEO to be equally as healthy and alive as Apple's founder currently is.

Do it, Satya. Do it now. Get a brick of Cobalt-40 and invite Gates to bring his pancreas over.

 



[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 06:58:11 EDT from Nurb432

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Other than a surface and Xbox, what did they have to offer in a store experience?  At least Apple had a product line they could stick on the tables/shelves. 

Note: never been in either, but i walked past an Apple store once, it had tables lined with phones and tablets and computers..

Mon Oct 04 2021 12:34:02 AM EDT from ParanoidDelusions

Went to the mall today, the Microsoft Store there has folded. Apple won that round. 

 

 



 



[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 09:32:28 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar

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Microsoft stores were great fun to look at. They are a direct ripoff of the Apple store -- the same shiny style, the same sign over the door that has the logo but no name, the same tables full of crap for people to look at.
When they were able, they rented space as close to the Apple store as possible.

The mall in Danbury, CT was really fun to look at. They built a Microsoft store directly across from the Apple store. The contrast was delightful to witness: an Apple store full of wide-eyed Apple faithful eager to acquire the next bottle of kool-aid they had to offer, and a Microsoft store directly across from it, completely empty. All the time.

[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 10:23:55 EDT from LoanShark

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Security on mass-produced computers. Some people have reported up to a

25% performance degradation when VBS is running.

Maybe on micro-benchmarks that nobody cares about, but for the most part those performance hits are a thing of a past, ever since Mode-Based Execution Control was added to CPUs.

And Win11 will probably require CPUs with MBEC as a baseline.

[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 10:25:26 EDT from LoanShark

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I enable VBS on all my boxes. No complaints about performance and relatively few about compatibility. It makes your setup more robust against rootkits.

[#] Mon Oct 04 2021 11:20:17 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar

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"What about the guy you lobotomized?"
"You're talking ancient history."

[#] Tue Oct 05 2021 12:46:35 EDT from LoanShark

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hehehe.

[#] Tue Oct 05 2021 23:50:18 EDT from LoanShark

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Well, I went and did it. Upgraded to Windows 11 and did the WSL1-WSL2 upgrade.


Graphics performance seems fine for Linux apps; unlike Virtualbox, everything is smooth, and on my Nvidia card, there is no need to install the "beta WSL CUDA" drivers; that's all rolled into the default install now.

Things are a little weird, visually. I guess the way Wayland works is that every Wayland server has its own default window borders unless the client draws its own, so WSL2's Wayland server by default draws window frames that look like neither native Windows nor native Linux. They stand out a lot. Some Linux apps (such as gnome-terminal) draw their own window frames, so gnome-terminal's windows look just like they do on Linux. But google-chrome's and firefox's get the WSL2 default treatment, which looks weird. Well, whatever, it's not a functional problem.


Graphics are hardware accelerated and seem *fast* so far; "glxinfo" will report something like:

$ glxinfo | grep renderer
GLX_MESA_query_renderer, GLX_MESA_swap_control, GLX_OML_swap_method,
GLX_EXT_visual_rating, GLX_MESA_copy_sub_buffer, GLX_MESA_query_renderer,

Extended renderer info (GLX_MESA_query_renderer):
OpenGL renderer string: D3D12 (NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3060 Ti)

Stability is not quite there yet. On this hardware, google-chrome consistently freezes/hangs every time you resize its window, but firefox works fine.

[#] Wed Oct 06 2021 00:00:55 EDT from LoanShark

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Graphics are mostly fast. Resizing some Linux windows (like Firefox) can feel sluggish, but so far I haven't noticed any problems with rendering or scrolling *within* the window, or moving it.

Overall this seems promising. Time will tell whether it's stable enough to use as a daily-driver.

[#] Wed Oct 06 2021 00:17:42 EDT from LoanShark

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Things are a little weird, visually. I guess the way Wayland works is

that every Wayland server has its own default window borders unless the

client draws its own, so WSL2's Wayland server by default draws window

frames that look like neither native Windows nor native Linux. They
stand out a lot. Some Linux apps (such as gnome-terminal) draw their
own window frames, so gnome-terminal's windows look just like they do

on Linux. But google-chrome's and firefox's get the WSL2 default
treatment, which looks weird. Well, whatever, it's not a functional
problem.

Update on this - it seems like it's an X11 vs Wayland thing. From what I can tell, Linux apps running in X11 mode get the crappy borders. Native Wayland stuff looks better.

It gets weird because I don't see an Xwayland process on the Linux side. So I guess WSL2 actually implements a rootless X server on the Windows side of the house, and that's what's drawing the window frames.

As I mentioned previously, google-chrome crashes on window resize when I run it at default settings (which appear to be X11 mode.) But I can force it to run in Wayland mode:

google-chrome-stable --enable-features=UseOzonePlatform --ozone-platform=wayland

when you run it this way, it doesn't hang on resize, and the window frame looks the way it's supposed to.

[#] Wed Oct 06 2021 00:34:06 EDT from LoanShark

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Unfortunately there are some little niceties (but important ones) that aren't implemented.

If you drag a window to the right, it should half-maximize and pin itself to the right side of your screen.

This just isn't happening for Linux apps.

[#] Wed Oct 06 2021 12:52:14 EDT from LoanShark

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WSL2-gui seems a little too unstable for daily use. I just had an incident where all the Linux windows disappeared, reappeard 30 seconds later (which suggests the RDP forwarder got killed and restarted, maybe) but after they came back, they were not responding to input.

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