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[#] Thu Feb 04 2021 09:58:01 EST from LoanShark

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2021-02-02 15:52 from IGnatius T Foobar
It's important to know whether vaccinated people are *more*
susceptible to *variant* strains which may be currently in the
minority

of what is circulating.

I think I'm missing something here, because that seems obvious.
Pathogen mutates into a treatment-resistant form, doesn't that happen

all the time?

I'm rambling, perhaps a bit too much, about Antibody-Dependent Enhancement.

I feel like vaccine efficacy is a crucial part of vaccine safety. Here's the thing: non-neutralizing, or weakly/poorly neutralizing antibodies can actually make disease worse.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antibody-dependent_enhancement

Although ADE may be the primary risk of vaccines, it is also perhaps a *greater* risk of natural infection. Most of the evidence to date seems to lean towards the idea that natural infection is not as protective as the Moderna or Pfizer products.

SARS-CoV-2 spike protein has multiple epitopes that can be the target of neutralizing antibodies, not all of which are on the RBD (this is documented fact now.) So while mutation may help the virus evade some antibodies, it is unlikely to fully escape all of them at least for the time being.

tl;dr: you're better off getting Pfizered or Moderna'd than getting SARS-CoV-2'd

[#] Thu Feb 04 2021 20:34:10 EST from LoanShark

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Maynard James Keenan contracted covid. Again.

https://variety.com/2021/music/news/maynard-james-keenan-covid19-second-time-1234900156/

[#] Sun Feb 07 2021 10:47:13 EST from ParanoidDelusions

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So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game over for humanity. 

The thing is contagious, everyone will get it, and eventually it'll wear you down and kill you. 

Let's be blunt - if there is a seasonal flu going around like Covid, even though Covid is benign in the vast majority of cases - repeated exposures to it, eventually you're going to get a big enough dose, after developing complications from it a previous time, that you're going to die a miserable death from it eventually. 

If they're telling us the truth about it - and they can't develop an actual cure... and it is seasonal Covid vaccinations for the rest of our lives... 

We better hope that Yellowstone goes off at the same time a meteor the size of Manhattan hits Asia or Europe, and puts us out of our suffering. 

 

Thu Feb 04 2021 20:34:10 EST from LoanShark

 



[#] Sun Feb 07 2021 10:50:25 EST from ParanoidDelusions

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There are probably naturally immune humans we haven't discovered yet - and it is likely we'll just see an evolution of humanity that is immune, or for whom the effects are ALWAYS mild and cold like. But for MOST of us - Covid has already punched our ticket, if we know it or not - in the worst case scenario.

I've been telling people since the start - THAT is what NATURAL herd immunity looks like. Africans with sickle-cell malaria were the only ones who survived to breed in malaria infested parts of Africa - until all Africans born in those areas had sickle cell anemia. You couldn't survive without it. 

There is probably something like that for Covid-19. But... the rest of us - we're the Africans *without* the sickle cell mutation that confers immunity to malaria. 

 

Sun Feb 07 2021 10:47:13 EST from ParanoidDelusions

So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game over for humanity. 

The thing is contagious, everyone will get it, and eventually it'll wear you down and kill you. 

Let's be blunt - if there is a seasonal flu going around like Covid, even though Covid is benign in the vast majority of cases - repeated exposures to it, eventually you're going to get a big enough dose, after developing complications from it a previous time, that you're going to die a miserable death from it eventually. 

If they're telling us the truth about it - and they can't develop an actual cure... and it is seasonal Covid vaccinations for the rest of our lives... 

We better hope that Yellowstone goes off at the same time a meteor the size of Manhattan hits Asia or Europe, and puts us out of our suffering. 

 

Thu Feb 04 2021 20:34:10 EST from LoanShark

 



 



[#] Sun Feb 07 2021 14:52:48 EST from Nurb432

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Its called evolution. There will be people with immunity. The weaker among us, die off and dont pass our inferior genes along. 

Sure, it sucks when its you being evolved out of the pool, but Its just how nature works and how things advance.  All our medical meddling of late has upset the balance, this might reset it.

Sun Feb 07 2021 10:47:13 EST from ParanoidDelusions

So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game over for humanity. 



[#] Wed Feb 10 2021 14:53:22 EST from LoanShark

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2021-02-07 10:47 from ParanoidDelusions
So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game
over for humanity. 

And you call me a pessimist.

[#] Wed Feb 10 2021 18:18:54 EST from zooer

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I am getting old.

When I go to any doctor's office they ask me if I have fallen since the last visit, and I am giddy when after a snow storm I get the driveway cleared to the bare asphalt. 

 



[#] Thu Feb 11 2021 13:56:34 EST from IGnatius T Foobar

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So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game
over for humanity. 

ummm ... how exactly does that happen?

Worst case scenario is that the vaccine doesn't work and humanity is reduced to those who are either naturally resistant or who have developed their own immunity.

My son works at a pharmacy over in the next town. He said that seven of his co-workers got the vaccine. All seven of them had really bad side effects.
This is not encouraging.

[#] Thu Feb 11 2021 14:00:48 EST from LoanShark

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My son works at a pharmacy over in the next town. He said that seven

of his co-workers got the vaccine. All seven of them had really bad
side effects.
This is not encouraging.

Bad but probably not long-term harmful. The shot is supposed to cause your immune system to flare up. The side-effects mean its working. They are temporary.

[#] Thu Feb 11 2021 16:14:26 EST from zooer

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"Really Bad" side effects needs a little more explanation.

If really bad side effects means it is working does "No side effects but my arm hurt a little" mean the vaccine isn't working?



[#] Thu Feb 11 2021 16:50:59 EST from Nurb432

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I hate migraines.  So debilitating.  



[#] Fri Feb 12 2021 09:44:00 EST from ParanoidDelusions

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My wife, who is one degree of Bacon from me, got both doses, and had no side effects. Wait. Her arm was sore. 

The other thing - It works by the nature of the "Sky Is Falling," rhetoric coming from those who want to keep the fear cycle of this disease at peak efficiency, IG. 


Notice how the official Uncensored voice of All the WORST news about the virus is TRUE and all the BEST news about the virus is FALSE went, "Hey, wait a minute there, you're going too far..." above in response to my post? 


If everything continues to happen according to the worst case scenarios of those who delight in the idea that the virus REQUIRES us to live the rest of eternity in perpetual fear while submitting ourselves to the unquestioned authority of a particular Governing ideology and philosophy - it doesn't matter - because it is game over for humanity. 


Something will cause our extinction eventually, and it could be a virus that we just can't mutate fast enough to overcome, that eventually kills *everyone* through attrition and birth rates unable to keep up with infection rates. This *could* be the one. It doesn't have to be a super volcano or irreversible climate change caused by Ford SUVs. 

It is funny how suggesting that this could be THAT virus got EVERYONE in this thread to go, "That isn't science!" 

Sure it is. We probably won't KNOW it is the super virus that is game over for humanity at first, if that is what punches our universal collective ticket. Hell, if it is a super volcano or galactic strike, the survivors will probably be rebuilding all the time on their road to inevitable extinction. 

I'm not a pessimist. I'm a realist. If we are unable to find a cure, the vaccine is ineffective against mutations, and subsequent infections are worse than previous infections, and mutations continue to produce more communicable and more lethal variations instead of less communicable and less lethal variations. 

We'll all die from it eventually, and r-type/k-type selection strategies may not be able to overcome the net negative population growth, all the way down into extinction. 

That is absolutely a plausible end-game for Covid-19 at this point. It may not be the MOST likely... but it probably isn't the least likely, either. 

Have a pleasant day, everyone. ;) 








Thu Feb 11 2021 13:56:34 EST from IGnatius T Foobar
So, if the vaccine doesn't work 100%, 100% of the time... it is game
over for humanity. 

ummm ... how exactly does that happen?

Worst case scenario is that the vaccine doesn't work and humanity is reduced to those who are either naturally resistant or who have developed their own immunity.

My son works at a pharmacy over in the next town. He said that seven of his co-workers got the vaccine. All seven of them had really bad side effects.
This is not encouraging.

 



[#] Fri Feb 12 2021 13:36:50 EST from Nurb432

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Of the few people i know personally who got the shot, about 1/2 said 'sore arm'. others said 'nothing'.  ( varying age ranges, as i know many in the medical field. Other than that, our state is going by age ) I'm thinking with i got my polo shot in the 60s, my arm was sore then too. If i remember right i had a scar for decades like many others.

I still doubt this is an extinction event. There will be people that have natural immunity, and they will continue the species.   Could it wipe out a large part of mankind in the process? Sure. Will it? Who knows, since we have proven our selves able to 'adjust' natural selection with our medical science. Would that be a bad thing if it did wipe out a huge percentage? From an evolutionary standpoint, probably not.



[#] Fri Feb 12 2021 17:20:59 EST from ParanoidDelusions

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Frankly, it wouldn't be my problem if it wiped every last one of us out. 

I could also get hit by a car walking my dog later this evening, though... so... 

 

Fri Feb 12 2021 13:36:50 EST from Nurb432

Of the few people i know personally who got the shot, about 1/2 said 'sore arm'. others said 'nothing'.  ( varying age ranges, as i know many in the medical field. Other than that, our state is going by age ) I'm thinking with i got my polo shot in the 60s, my arm was sore then too. If i remember right i had a scar for decades like many others.

I still doubt this is an extinction event. There will be people that have natural immunity, and they will continue the species.   Could it wipe out a large part of mankind in the process? Sure. Will it? Who knows, since we have proven our selves able to 'adjust' natural selection with our medical science. Would that be a bad thing if it did wipe out a huge percentage? From an evolutionary standpoint, probably not.



 



[#] Sat Feb 13 2021 16:13:23 EST from Nurb432

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"Polo shot"???????

 

Man, i really gotta get a new keyboard, and slow down.   Even when i hear the key click, it does not mean it actually registered. And i'm really bad about proof-reading.



[#] Wed Feb 17 2021 20:07:58 EST from ParanoidDelusions

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My mental auto-correct fixed it without me even noticing. 

 

Sat Feb 13 2021 16:13:23 EST from Nurb432

"Polo shot"???????

 

Man, i really gotta get a new keyboard, and slow down.   Even when i hear the key click, it does not mean it actually registered. And i'm really bad about proof-reading.



 



[#] Thu Feb 18 2021 08:01:41 EST from nonservator

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"SO MANY AMERICANS DIED BECAUSE AMERICA IS SO STUPID!"

Uh huh.



[#] Fri Feb 19 2021 20:25:07 EST from LoanShark

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Mother, Should I Trust the Government?

My girlfriend works at a hospital in NYC. She's been hearing through the grapevine that the city/state (same thing) is planning to redirect vaccine supply from hospitals to the city/state run vaccination sites, such as Javits Center. Supply is very tight right now, and we're hearing about hospital(s) that have had to cancel vaccination appointments, including second shots for health care workers.

Which leads to an interesting question: if I want to get vaccinated (and I am now eligible due to NYS' expanded list of comorbidities), should I trust the government-run sites to deliver as promised, or the hospital-run sites? ;-)

[#] Fri Feb 19 2021 21:16:59 EST from zooer

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New York state has many problems with vaccine distribution, but don't blame Mario Cuomo, he is not to blame.*
NY state has had problems with people in one region making appointments in other regions and traveling outside their region to get the vaccine.  If you really want a vaccine NOW, you can see if there are appointments on LI or in northern Westchester County.

 

*As quoted from Chris Cuomo.



[#] Fri Feb 19 2021 22:02:37 EST from LoanShark

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Fucking shit. Everybody's travelling to Potsdam right now.

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