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[#] Sun Oct 11 2015 23:09:19 EDT from ax25

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He could always come back as Edsel. Nobody would pick that.

[#] Wed Oct 28 2015 08:23:21 EDT from fleeb

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Heh... 'Bjarne Stroustrup tower'... I can't decide if that's kind of unkind.

[#] Tue Nov 10 2015 15:41:44 EST from dothebart

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Trying to explain the phrase "it's not a bug it's a feature" to a musician. Them: "Oh! It's playing it wrong and calling it jazz!"

found on twitter  ;-)

[#] Wed Nov 11 2015 16:50:27 EST from LoanShark

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So didn't they forget to mention Java and hasn't that already happened?

[#] Wed Nov 11 2015 18:31:27 EST from dothebart

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as long as the java interpreter is written in c/c++ - no, that didn't happen.

Thats something these languages try to achieve. Replace the full stack for base logic.

Java may be the lingua franca of business logic - but thats about it.

[#] Thu Nov 12 2015 10:33:06 EST from LoanShark

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Oh, OK. Is this really realistic, you can't replace an OS kernel with a GC-based language and expect decent results.

[#] Fri Nov 13 2015 11:14:13 EST from fleeb

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If Windows was good enough, maybe it doesn't matter.


[#] Fri Nov 13 2015 12:38:24 EST from LoanShark

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Windows *is* good enough. Ok maybe the only real complaint these days is it wants you to reboot every time there's a patch.

Nobody really patches their servers on time anyway...

[#] Mon Nov 16 2015 05:40:23 EST from dothebart

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I guess its rather writing /bin/true in another language than c. while booting the java interpreter will take way to much time for such a simple task, I guess go will do much better.

[#] Mon Nov 16 2015 14:17:09 EST from LoanShark

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the project(s) I'm working on take quite a long time to boot, thes days. we are upwards of 5000 .class files for things like auto-generated JAXB schemas. I guess some of those sit unused, but still. It's a lot for the JIT to ponder.

then when you add the Groovy abstraction layer on top of the Java abstraction layer, it all becomes ridiculous.

Groovy the language has some real misfeatures, and Grails the framework is a pile of shit.

[#] Mon Nov 16 2015 16:21:14 EST from dothebart

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well, thats the java lightweight - as in containership leightweight.

[#] Sat Nov 21 2015 13:48:58 EST from IGnatius T Foobar

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Every time interpreted languages get better, there's another layer of applications that become reasonable to write in them. The operating system itself is not likely to ever become a candidate because you need something to run the interpreter on, of course.

If I were starting Citadel today it certainly wouldn't be written in C. Python or even JavaScript would be the language of choice. You can go [4~to any of the major evil-software houses and they'd probably say the same thing about their major applications.

What might change is the definition of what an operating system is. Linux and Windows will always need to run on bare metal, but there might be a whole new generation of small operating systems designed for direct-to-cloud deployment, and depending on what "the cloud" consists of, those might be written in interpreted languages.

Considering how long COBOL was the lingua franca of business logic, it's likely that Java will have that role for quite some time. The only reason that changed in the first place was because COBOL became so horrifyingly obsolete and didn't evolve, something *had* to replace it.

Perhaps a better question to ask would be:

1. What language is best to learn for a new programmer looking for a career?

2. What language is best to learn if you're only in it for the love of the craft?

[#] Mon Nov 23 2015 13:44:05 EST from LoanShark

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2. What language is best to learn if you're only in it for the love of

the craft?

I'm gonna proposal an oddball answer to this one. And I don't even know this language, so take a grain of salt.

Visual F#

[#] Tue Nov 24 2015 09:57:20 EST from dothebart

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btw, Loanshark, infact there _are_ operating systems with garbage collected languages:

[#] Tue Nov 24 2015 12:50:16 EST from LoanShark

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I'd be very surprised if the OS kernel is actually in JS. This thing is probably running Linux.

[#] Tue Nov 24 2015 12:53:54 EST from LoanShark

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Sounds like it's too small to be Linux, but it's really using standard techniques to host a JS interpreter fairly close to the bare metal - that's written in C/C++


[#] Tue Nov 24 2015 12:54:29 EST from LoanShark

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... grr.

Yes. The Espruino boards use relatively standard ST Microelectronics ARM Cortex M3/M4 chips, so any tool that will produce code for those can be used to program the boards. There are extremely good C and C++ compilers available, as well as Lua and
Python interpreters for the Cortex M4 chip that is in the Pico.

Instead of replacing the Espruino JavaScript interpreter you can also write your own extensions to it using C and C++. There's some more information on that here."

[#] Tue Nov 24 2015 16:26:39 EST from dothebart

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no, its definitely not linux - it'd be at most ELKs since the cortex M3 cpu doesn't have a MMU ;-)

but, the V8 engine etc. is written in C++

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