Phoenix is weird because people from all over the country want to winter here - and so we end up with a lot of operations that open a second place out here. There is NY bagel place out here - and they filter the water to add the same chemical profile as New York tap water to make their dough - and my friend from New Jersey swears they've nailed it. 

That's an interesting variation of the trope I've heard a million times: some pizza place or bagel place, usually in Florida, run by a New York expat, that supposedly brings in tanker loads of New York tap water to make their dough.

Obviously if you think about that even a little, the cost and mechanics of transporting and storing all that water would be clearly untenable.

The variant of adjusting local water to match New York's "chemical profile" sounds more plausible.  Because tap water obviously is more than water, it's the minerals and other impurities that affect the taste of your tap water.  If they can match the pH and the mineral profile of some distant city's municipal supply, it's theoretically possible.

It is a real thing here - and the place is booming, mostly with East Coast expatriates. The kitchen looks a little bit like a brewery or distillery. They're doing some serious things with the tap water here. 

It probably isn't perfect. But I bet you can get CLOSE. 

And when you're not at home, close is better than nothing at all. 

Sat Dec 20 2025 22:30:37 UTC from Nurb432

And since its not a bazillion degrees out, i get to cook again.

Tonight's menu. Real pizza, 2 layer.  ( and yes, that is a plate from the 1970s.. no one should be surprised about that )

 

Same plate set here, trying to complete the set.  Very much trying to find the matching silverware . . i've got enough of the plates and other dishes to make it useful enough, but I've only ever seen pictures of the matching silverware

Be careful, there are cheap counterfeits out there now.  Never dreamed there would be a market for that.

I found out the hard way.   They look real, until you get them.  They just seem 'off' slightly ( the design is not quite in the right spot and a mm or 2 off, or the color is off a few degrees ) tho many would never notice but when you flip the over, no logo... so anyone would.

I bought 4 of them couple of years ago off fleabay to add to the collection ( and wife had just broke one of them.. so i was down to 3 of the smaller ones ),  and of course i noticed as soon as i opened the box, "hey, this dont look right.. " but it being 1 mm off is enough for me to notice something was wrong.  Im just that way, detail oriented. lol. Was cheep and only 4 of them and they looked close enough to use, so I kept them, and sure enough they are cheaply made and started chipping within a month.   From now on, ill only get them if i can touch them first.

Sun Dec 28 2025 12:28:56 UTC from PanaSonic

 

 

 

Same plate set here, trying to complete the set.  Very much trying to find the matching silverware . . i've got enough of the plates and other dishes to make it useful enough, but I've only ever seen pictures of the matching silverware

 

If it scratches your itch - who cares - until someone tells you it is fake and ruins it for you? 

That is how I feel about everything retro. If you're happy and it takes you back - no one cares - until some asshole goes, "look, that isn't RIGHT," and then you can't unsee how it isn't just right. But before then - you were happy. 

I don't know about YOU - but I know who I think is the asshole, in this case. 

Tue Feb 24 2026 18:42:57 UTC from darknetuser

I eventually managed to get hold of a BUdweiser. Don't ask how.

It was not bad but it was not very special either. It was too light for my taste.

So, my first trip to England, October 2001. My Niece, the 1st born of my Nephew, who is 4 years younger than me (long story) - died of menengitis. I had never been further away from California than Boston. I got an emergency passport, flew to England, buried his daughter, and 9-11 happened. Absolute horror. I also had a 9 month old baby back home - that I had because, "if my fuck-up Nephew can raise a kid, so can I." Seriously - that was a part of my logic in finally giving in and having a kid. "If HE can do it, so can I!" See my message in the lobby for how that worked out. Better for me than for him. 

But - while I was there -  I wasn't very sophisticated or wordly about world-travel - so at the pubs I was ordering Budweiser - because I'm American. My Nephew stopped me, going, "Dude, it is 4 pounds 50 pence per Bud, and because of the exchange rate, you're paying $9 per Bud. Stop. That is an expensive US Import. Buy Stella, same thing, tastes the same, 2 pounds 25 pence per bottle - $5. Don't be an idiot." 

This was before Bud owned Stella. But he was right. So I drank Stella, and developed a taste for it. My first WORDLY experience. Came back, on the 2nd Virgin domestic flight back to SFO after 9-11 - and became a Stella drinker. More expensive - but well travelled. Then Budweiser bought it - and it just became "The same shit."

The Stella/Bud thing is super strong for me. 

Fri Mar 20 2026 14:02:35 UTC from IGnatius T Foobar

Funny thing about that. A-B has a bunch of brands that are either "Joe Sixpack" brands or "Exotic" brands depending on where you happen to be in the world.

In the US, they market Budweiser as the everyday cheapie brand and Stella Artois as the sophisticated one.

Overseas, it's the opposite. Same brews, different audience, different marketing perception.

I wonder if they're all just different labels on the same beer now, Budweiser, Stella, Michelob, Rolling Rock, Busch, etc. all come out of the same tank of swill and get thrown into whatever bottles are on the line that day.

I loved Rolling Rock in my late teens and early 20s. I can't drink it at all now - it is piss. Absolute swill. 
Let me put it this way - I'd rather have a Bud Lite - given the choice. 

I think I tried Rolling Rock in my 20's in an afterparty of some sort in a hotel room.  I couldn't finish it.

It is swill. 

Using bread flour is better than 'general purpose' as it has more protein for a stronger gluten.  All about texture, not flavor.   And myself i also add corn meal to the dough.

While i can see a point to a grill, for me its not as temp controllable as an oven.  Tho i did get a cast iron pan that fit my grill, just for that reason. 

Mon Apr 20 2026 14:28:55 UTC from LoanShark

we've started cooking pizza on the grill--not sure why we never did this before. grill marks on freshly baked dough are niiice.

so far we've been using premade-dough-in-a-bag. mostly frozen stuff; not sure what type of flour was used. just picked up another bag of neapolitan style dough, from the fridge section at Target, made from 00 flour. idk if this will work as well since a grill is more like a convection oven than a pizza oven in terms of temperature. we shall see...

IG will say I'm doing this wrong and that I need to use bread flour and NYC tap water. this isn't pizza, it's just 'za.


but--it's topped with my handmade, minimal-ingredients marinara that tastes nice and bright.

Not disparaging flame grilling. its how the real folks do it in Chicago.   But, my outdoor grill, just isn't predictable/controllable enough. its one reason i don't use it much for anything really.  Actually its been so long the grates and flame covers rotted. I bought new ones. They sit in a box in the garage.. Have for several years..

Mon Apr 20 2026 15:23:29 UTC from LoanShark

I have a Smoke probe from Thermoworks and I'm willing to fiddle with knobs for the 8 whole minutes it takes to grill one directly on the grates, plus the box of oak chips over the burner really adds that wood-fired flavor.

The Bread Flour thing is apparently the way to make a NYC-style crust. (DON'T GET IG STARTED.) Personally I might prefer all-purpose flour; pizza dough can do bad things to my large intestine.

When i was a kid, we did the fire pit. I also camped A LOT. Here, i don't think they are even legal since i still live in 'city limits' ( cant even have chickens. Total bastards running things. this used to be rural town.  Freaking hate this place now ), but we did get one of those above ground metal burner pit things. But, much like the grill it sat unused. Eventually was given away to one of the kids.  

And due to same reason of 'being a pain to manage' my grill is propane instead of charcoal/wood .  But, still its a pain...

Wed Apr 22 2026 09:42:20 UTC from darknetuser

2026-04-20 18:26 from Nurb432
Not disparaging flame grilling. its how the real folks do it in
Chicago.   But, my outdoor grill, just isn't
predictable/controllable enough. its one reason i don't use it
much for anything really.  Actually its been so long the grates

and flame covers rotted. I bought new ones. They sit in a box in

the garage.. Have for several years..

You guys are so modern.

My grandpa dug a hole in the ground, dumped flammable material into it, lighted it up, placed a grill on the hole and cooked on the ambers.

But yeah back then if you where an honorably discharged vet or whatever the government gave you a house if you happened to have lost yours (war and stuff) but the ones that they could hand you were essentially holes digged by the side of a mountain and electricity and running water were not on the menu, so...

These days we can afford better and while I keep many gas cans at home jus in case, I find cooking on wood or coal is hard to beat. First of all t is way cheaper, secondly it tastes much better. The only downsides is it requires practice to get temperatures right, the equipment is harder to clean, and it takes longer.